What strikings me, or surprises me is that many "ports/packages" compile just fine on freebsd where they don't on gentoo-linux, which you would expect.
I do miss dtmail, an MH based email app on OSF/1 and Tru64. dxmail, which was on Solaris 9, never really cut it for me. I've searched for dtmail sources but none can be found, else I'd port it to FreeBSD.
The RPM-based distros are just soulless for me, though. I know they are going for ease-of-use and avoiding dependency-hell with their Software/App Stores using Snapd/Flatpak/containerd environments for applications, but it just seems pointless to me because that's what Windows is for.taiwan740 ,
In SuSE you can choose the wicked network manager and leave NetworkManager aside. You can also handle YaST in console.
I also used Debian Xfce without any widgets, just using wpa_supplicant and /etc/network/intefaces, like on FreeBSD.
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(Research not necessary)
That was a "Frankenstein O.S"gentoo-FreeBSD is dead. Their developers have dropped the project.
I like "devuan". It even makes my Brother printer work.The RPM-based distros are just soulless for me, though. I know they are going for ease-of-use and avoiding dependency-hell with their Software/App Stores using Snapd/Flatpak/containerd environments for applications, but it just seems pointless to me because that's what Windows is for.
I used to have a desktop that I built using Linux From Scratch, that was interesting for a bit, but now it all uses that meson/ninja stuff which just feels like the hipsters have moved in and tried to make what was perfectly fine before all edgy and buzzwordy because they can't go through the day without making some kind of reference to Japan.
There's a pattern with those kind of projects failing due to lack of developers/interest.gentoo-FreeBSD is dead. Their developers have dropped the project.
Yeah, it is a bit reinventing the wheel, but I did like trying out these kinds of projects in 2000-2010. In fact, earlier this year I tried to get a laptop working with Debian kFreeBSD but it's just fell into dependency hell, something to do with libffm if I recall correctly, and also something to do with the FreeBSD kernel determining the architecture as "amd64" but the GNU userland reporting it as "x86_64" so build tools (I think this was meson...) couldn't determine the config.There's a pattern with those kind of projects failing due to lack of developers/interest.
Debian tried it several years ago and was also long abandoned and then officially ended this year.
I find that you tend to read the rationale for these projects and it's never very compelling. Users of FreeBSD will use FreeBSD, users of Linux distros, will use those. These types of projects are just very niche and there are no advantages to either camp in switching.
Thank you for open sourcing CDE.I was on the original team that got CDE open-sourced and ported to modern systems back in ~2012. I still have anxiety attacks from the memory of its rotten build system even now. Wrangling that cruft was certainly the hardest part. My personal maintained version uses CMake (and now has almost all IPC + tooltalk removed).
I recall we had to strip some bits out that we thought we would never be able to get ported. Have you contacted Peter Howkins (flibble) or Jon Trulson (jon13) to see if they have better luck digging it out?
It really stems from my original OpenCDE project here (screenshots).I'd be interested in hearing more about your personal version. Is it a set of patches that are applied to the current version of CDE? Do you update your patches when new versions are released?
I messed with it some. Even got a mixed Openbsd / Gentoo-freebsd IPSec VPN working. I gave up on it at the end because it was essentially a new platform. It wasn't Linux or Freebsd, but rather its own thing.That was a "Frankenstein O.S"
A lot of X software was messy at the time. Large projects also tended to become a mess as kludges evolved to work around dillemmas. In other words not really solutions.It really stems from my original OpenCDE project here (screenshots).
I decommissioned OpenCDE Once CDE was GPL'ed. However I realized that the actual CDE was not as fun to work on because it was pretty messy. I also was concerned at the time that people were looking at putting in different ("modern") font rendering, pulling in dbus, fragmenting it and generally breaking the thing more. So I kind of went my own way completely. The only way that one guy can maintain a fork of such a large project is to greatly simplify it; and so I did.
It is a hard fork (not a patch kit in this case) and I don't really keep patches in sync; the projects have diverged considerably.
Just now, I saw that the Handbook has been updated, and has a chapter on Wayland...Are you actually using plasma-wayland ? How are you achieving this?
Getting a dual-boot FreeBSD and Gentoo system working is a fun challenge if you want to scrape a little deeper than the 'buntu'sI have been using FreeBSD for a week now (well, using and using, mainly testing and setting up, but it is definitely a keeper). I have some prior experience with simple Linux distro (Ubuntu & Xubuntu), and FreeBSD revealed itself to me as a perfect answer to the question: "Which distro should I move to to advance my Linux knowledgde?". Irony intended.
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… why you've picked FreeBSD instead of Linux, Mac…? IMHO, it would be great to have this kind of information up to date in 2023.
… I guess force of habit. Change is hard. …
… resulting bit of knowledge is what makes this forum so much better than, say, Reddit.
… Disadvantages I can cope with:
- Suspend/Hibernation, …
… also considering OpenBSD as some say that it works good on laptops (suspend/resume for example) …
It doesn't have to be "instead of". It can be "as well as". At work I have a Windows laptop …
… Apple … perfectly good hardware is "no longer supported" …
Are you actually using plasma-wayland ? How are you achieving this?
… I do agree with the idea of an option: It should simply give this message: "Now read the f*cking Handbook, pick your DE/WM and install it. Good luck!".
… Documentation (the Handbook) needs to be upgraded, …
… big, bloated, fat and ugly …
What desktop environment that should be? Who gets to decide? …
… the base graphical installer for FreeBSD should have two options, one for the base system installation, and the other by continuation of the desktop environment by default. But no....
… End users have their own tastes when it comes to using the systems, and therefore, not be told to look for other systems, …
… forget … the bluetooth, …
FreeBSD also never bugs out nor do I have to worry about software availability.
… Firefox … 109 and later, it's got awful memory leaks that cannot be stopped …
That was my experience when I used gentoo many years ago. There were all kinds of issues with "masking" and "emerge" would fail all the time for various types of reasons. At least when something fails on FreeBSD it is not too hard to figure out what the problem is and the fix is relatively straight-forward. You don't need to go down the "rabbit hole", so to speak, and spend countless hours screwing around with the configuration.What strikings me, or surprises me is that many "ports/packages" compile just fine on freebsd where they don't on gentoo-linux, which you would expect.
when something fails on FreeBSD it is not too hard to figure out what the problem is
You can still get to have this kind of fun on Freebsd if you mix packages you didn't build with ports.That was my experience when I used gentoo many years ago. There were all kinds of issues with "masking" and "emerge" would fail all the time for various types of reasons. At least when something fails on FreeBSD it is not too hard to figure out what the problem is and the fix is relatively straight-forward. You don't need to go down the "rabbit hole", so to speak, and spend countless hours screwing around with the configuration.
Yep, especially if you do a kernel/world update like to STABLE or CURRENT, some things that are already installed with pkg, you need to reinstall with ports. At least ports does report to the package manager, which is way better than if you download a .tar.gz from the internet and compile from source.You can still get to have this kind of fun on Freebsd if you mix packages you didn't build with ports.
Ports do download a tarball from Internet and compile from source, y'know...Yep, especially if you do a kernel/world update like to STABLE or CURRENT, some things that are already installed with pkg, you need to reinstall with ports. At least ports does report to the package manager, which is way better than if you download a .tar.gz from the internet and compile from source.
make install
, make deinstall
, make reinstall
work with much less dependency nonsense than pkg.Yes but I believe it's scripted so that it updates the pkg database when the port installs. So pkg "knows" you have installed xorg from ports, for example.Ports do download a tarball from Internet and compile from source, y'know...make install
,make deinstall
,make reinstall
work with much less dependency nonsense than pkg.
./configure && make && make install
I don't think pkg has any idea that piece of software is installed and therefore doesn't know that xorg already being there satisfies the dependency when you do pkg install xfce4
later, pkg is going to download and install the xorg package again.