Install FreeBSD on a Smartphone

I

Idk

Hello,

i wanna install FreeBSD on my old Smartphone, but there are no Apps or Videos on Youtube belong to Linux. How can i install FreeBSD with an App like "Linux Deploy" or "Termux" but no qemu or Linux.
Are there some Apps or should i install Linux?

Thank you for the Answers!
 
Short answer, you cannot install FreeBSD on a smartphone device. Longer answer, while there are several ARM based boards that work, none of them have any kind of "phone" capabilities. Phones contain various chipsets and the ARM SoC is just a small part of it. The SoC alone is tricky because they're all different and not all of them provide adequate documentation to even begin writing drivers for them.

 
You generally can't install a regular Linux on a smart phone either. Termux and all those chroot technologies are really just leveraging the fact that Android is already just a (messy, horrible) version of Linux.

It will be fairly slow but I have used this in the past to run Plan 9 and OpenBSD on Android (https://github.com/limboemu/limbo). A novelty but not fantastically usable considering smart phones are fairly terrible compared to even a cheap laptop found in a dustbin.
 
Idk said:
Hello,

i wanna install FreeBSD on my old Smartphone, but there are no Apps or Videos on Youtube belong to Linux. How can i install FreeBSD with an App like "Linux Deploy" or "Termux" but no qemu or Linux.
Are there some Apps or should i install Linux?

Thank you for the Answers!
Click to expand...
Linux Deploy and Termux works more like a chroot, so it'll reuse the system calls from android (linux if you must) so no, unless you have some sort of hypervisor or emulator for android (which I don't know if exists).
 
He spent 6 hours on the forums yesterday. Most of them are typically gone 5 minutes after signing up and posting. So I'm kind of hoping it's not a troll, just somebody that doesn't know any better.
 
Menelkir said:
unless you have some sort of hypervisor or emulator for android (which I don't know if exists).
Click to expand...
Not sure about hypervisors (in theory, with a Linux kernel, you might be able to get kvm running), but emulators exist for sure, e.g. Bochs for running some x86 systems.
 
If it were possible to install a BSD on a smart phone, the best bet is NetBSD, but I doubt that's possible. NetBSD works with more hardware architectures. The architecture of that phone has to be supported by that operative system. If something for that is only available in Linux, then use that. Something like this would be for browsing the Internet on a smart phone through your home wifi.

There's Pinephone, https://www.pine64.org/pinephone/, which is a physical smart phone that works with opensource software. It comes with its own version of Linux.

If you want a phone system, that goes on your computer, that allows other softphones and hardphones to work off of, try Freeswitch or Asterisk as a PBX (Private Branch Exchange). Using TrueNAS or a custom GUI OS of Freeswitch or Asterisk would be easier than installing a PBX on FreeBSD. These go on the computer and not on the individual phones that use the PBX system. I never heard of using a smart phone with open source software as a soft phone for use with Asterisk or FreeSwitch. There's softphone software, though this is for a computer. If it were possible, it would be using the phone over wifi, and not through a SIM card.

I use an old smart phone over Wifi for browsing the Internet, but it retains the original Android operating system that came with it. It always has an indication that it needs the SIM card. I haven't even checked if the Android/Google store is accessible on it. I doubt it is, and I wouldn't try it without a working SIM card, because it's probably not intended to be. That's something you would want to read about online before even trying. There's nothing for SIMs in terms of opensource that would only work on Wifi or a bring your own hardware phone IP phone service.

As a similar task, for me, installing a BSD or Linux firewall on a gateway is something I can't wrap my head around achieving. There's operating systems made for that, but there's no place to put the USB for installing it, maybe it's done over the network. Using Raspberry Pi or a BugleBoard which are supported by many open source operating systems is something I haven't tried, but I could remotely see myself trying that. Operating systems are meant to work on many of those hardware architectures, as they're listed on their download pages. I can't wrap my head around installing FreeBSD on an old smart phone, and it won't work if the phone's hardware architecture isn't supported by the particular OS. I've been here a while, and can't do many of these tasks which are possible.
 
Three cheers for Pinephone. That is our best option looking forward

I would take a half working Pinephone over any smartphone anyday.
I need more control of my tracking device.

SirDice said:
He spent 6 hours on the forums yesterday.
Click to expand...
Jeez I would hate to see my specs.
What kinda stats can you glean from me? Daily, Weekly or Monthly hour count?
 
Don't have any "extensive" stats. Just the information from the profile.
Code: 
Joined:     Yesterday at 2:17 PM
Last seen:     Yesterday at 8:36 PM

Most spammers (or trolls) usually don't spend that much time hanging around. They usually sign up, post their nonsense, then bugger off. Never to be seen again.
 
I have defiantly seen that profile.
Sometimes troll, sometimes leaving because its too hard. Many flamethowers with temp accounts.
 
sidetone said:
If it were possible to install a BSD on a smart phone, the best bet is NetBSD, but I doubt that's possible. NetBSD works with more hardware architectures. The architecture of that phone has to be supported by that operative system. If something for that is only available in Linux, then use that. Something like this would be for browsing the Internet on a smart phone through your home wifi.

There's Pinephone, https://www.pine64.org/pinephone/, which is a physical smart phone that works with opensource software. It comes with its own version of Linux.

If you want a phone system, that goes on your computer, that allows other softphones and hardphones to work off of, try Freeswitch or Asterisk as a PBX (Private Branch Exchange). Using TrueNAS or a custom GUI OS of Freeswitch or Asterisk would be easier than installing a PBX on FreeBSD. These go on the computer and not on the individual phones that use the PBX system. I never heard of using a smart phone with open source software as a soft phone for use with Asterisk or FreeSwitch. There's softphone software, though this is for a computer. If it were possible, it would be using the phone over wifi, and not through a SIM card.

I use an old smart phone over Wifi for browsing the Internet, but it retains the original Android operating system that came with it. It always has an indication that it needs the SIM card. I haven't even checked if the Android/Google store is accessible on it. I doubt it is, and I wouldn't try it without a working SIM card, because it's probably not intended to be. That's something you would want to read about online before even trying. There's nothing for SIMs in terms of opensource that would only work on Wifi or a bring your own hardware phone IP phone service.

As a similar task, for me, installing a BSD or Linux firewall on a gateway is something I can't wrap my head around achieving. There's operating systems made for that, but there's no place to put the USB for installing it, maybe it's done over the network. Using Raspberry Pi or a BugleBoard which are supported by many open source operating systems is something I haven't tried, but I could remotely see myself trying that. Operating systems are meant to work on many of those hardware architectures, as they're listed on their download pages. I can't wrap my head around installing FreeBSD on an old smart phone, and it won't work if the phone's hardware architecture isn't supported by the particular OS. I've been here a while, and can't do many of these tasks which are possible.
Click to expand...

hello
as a rare freebsd user, i'd like to react, even if it would be more to that specific post, as it's very shame the thread is locked (it's a HUGE debate about bsd systems and embedded devices, especially smartphones):
forums.freebsd.org

Let's start a new project : let's create a new mobile device powered by FreeBSD.

Hello Freebsd-Lovers. I plan to buy the "PINEPHONE – Beta Edition with Convergence Package Linux SmartPhone". I would like to install FreeBSD instead of Linux on this device. I would like to create a team of developers. I can help those developers,but not deeply,because I'm a system...
forums.freebsd.org forums.freebsd.org

Beastie7 said:
How will you handle cellular communication? Getting all major telecoms to support the system for CMDA/GSM/SMS communication is going to be a challenge. Does FreeBSD even have drivers for this type of stuff?
How will you handle software distribution? I presume you'll have to host a repository yourself along with a way for users to administer mobile apps and system updates over-the-air; another major challenge.
How will the system be installed? One of the reasons why I loathe GrapheneOS is because it requires chrome for installs/updates. When the install medium should be its own cross-platform utility.
How will third party applications be developed? There's no truly open source toolkit out there for mobile devices. Except maybe Qt; you'll probably need a commercial license for this kind of project. Who the hell wants to write mobile apps in C++ anyways?

Also, in order for a project like this to gain any momentum; you'll have to create a community around it for people to collaborate with. Assuming you'll want to keep it open source. Making a mobile OS is ridiculously complicated.
Click to expand...
it's very sad as it's not possible to reply to this person, as the same for the rest of the whole topic, which is a huge interesting (and it's really sad of it), especailly for the last one : would ask for hundred of devs and a community.

well, opensource works exacly like it:
it would take years. But:
guys at apple knew making a phone based on something totally new, was impossible. So they did it, called the iphone (thank you carnegie mellon)

teams of google knew making a phone based on something totally new, was impossible. So they did it, called android. (imho, i hate it)

three nerds, few hackers and several linuxians, plus tiny army of engineer were convinced that create a independent-linux mobile system to replace android was a totally hugely-stupid idea. So they did, since 2017 postmarketos is just kind of refreshed-2013-iphone, but it works better than old iphone, with ten years of support on mainline kernel. They has been told "will never work, nobody wants it" ; that's not "how it finished", because it's only the beginning, since seven years. personally, i run postmarket on few samsung oldies devices, and it run wells ; would hugely appreciate to run free/net/openbsd in addition, just, as foos prayers says : just for fun.

bsdians, what are you waiting for?
 
lm2lm2 said:
guys at apple knew making a phone based on something totally new, was impossible. So they did it, called the iphone (thank you carnegie mellon)
[...]
teams of google knew making a phone based on something totally new, was impossible. So they did it, called android. (imho, i hate it)
[...]
bsdians, what are you waiting for?
Click to expand...
An open-source community is very different to commercial companies like Apple and Google (Plus, Android Inc made Android, Google just acquired it years later).

I think we should at least wait until the vanilla upstream Linux kernel works on a phone. Currently Linux users can only run inside a chroot on Android which is kind of cheating. I think just last year postmarketOS has managed it for a tiny fraction of devices.

And other than hobbyists having a quick play, no-one is seriously making use of "normal" Linux on mobiles. The hardware is cheap and prone to breaking and has extremely limited sourcability guarantees. It is EOL almost as soon as you walk out of the shop.

But certainly it could be fun (albeit difficult!) for some skilled developers. At the very least it would help improve the ARM(64) support and other general portability of FreeBSD.
 
I am using Pinephone with arch danctnix and sxmo. It runs smooth, and waydroid interface with lineageOS to run android apps that is a must (banking, uber, etc). I had a little time asking my banking to allow my device to be used and that work. I do calls, send messages, in a daily drive. It is really cool and I do not see reason to go back to mainstream devices, since everything just works with some tinkering. I mean, it was easier to me than learning some of BSD basis that today I find really cool and better than linux. But that is it, I do not have the skills for doing that for BSD myself, and really takes good skilled and focused people to make that a reallity.

The hardware is cheap and prone to breaking and has extremely limited sourcability guarantees. It is EOL almost as soon as you walk out of the shop.
Click to expand...

I do not find this trully. Unix is about getting hardware to the limit. Is about using older computers and still, getting some of it. Capital keeps asking for more power, more ram, more CPU. It pushs forwards and decontinue old hardware so new can be made, and used. Things get complex and worse and consume more and more.

Those ideas, postmakert, lineageOS, etc, are the effort of going the other way. We do not need "more" anything.

But that is it. It is a niche. A nice one, and I really believe it will grown in the coming years.
 
kpedersen said:
For standard hardware, absolutely but as an example; how old is your oldest phone that you still get use from personally?
Click to expand...
I think it is a motog from 2015.

But that happens because everything is proprietary. The ones who owns the resources can decide how, where, why to drop, decontinue, and so on.

I believe that when there is open option and interessed people at maintining it, things will not be trashed.

Yeah, alot of things can happen like telecom companies just dropping support of a carrier kind of connection, and so on. But seeing the pinephone case, it then, would just be needed to change the modem, not the entire phone. A part of the hardware dosent work anymore, but the rest is still plenty.

I that case, yeah, we would still also depending that the manofacturer sees advantage and $$$ on it. But well, I believe that is possible. In the worst case, I will get a mobile computer, but it will not be discarted, because a lot of things will keep possible.
 
kpedersen said:
for a tiny fraction of devices.
Click to expand...
i think few hundreds of device is kind of "a bit more" than fraction of few devices

never saw freebsd, sailfish, nor ubuntu touch running on samsung, htc, huaewi, xiaomi devices.
postmarketos, do.


kpedersen said:
But certainly it could be fun (albeit difficult!) for some skilled developers. At the very least it would help improve the ARM(64) support and other general portability of FreeBSD.
Click to expand...
it have to start ..:)

dostoievsky said:
Those ideas, postmakert, lineageOS, etc, are the effort of going the other way. We do not need "more" anything.
Click to expand...

why exclude free/*bsd systems from alternatives to android phones?
i see no reason... postmarketos wasn't supposed to exist, as several android's projects were already alternatives.
but it exists partly to flee/avoid android's fundamentals.


dostoievsky said:
But that is it. It is a niche. A nice one, and I really believe it will grown in the coming years.
Click to expand...
i think librem and PP, plus fairphone's users, would be glad to have a *bsd system compatible with their device.

it can die too.
i haven't heard about really bad feedback or just people regretting the existence of sailfish and ubuntu touch. Before postmarketos, they were the two only projects and systems aiming to just do something different than android. both were only ones, really.
since 2017, and now kind of fully usable (i have one in my daily usage), postmarketos was added as it was neither expected (as availability), nor with at least same or even more success than UB/sailfish, whom are just very niche because of lack of various manufacturers devices support.

now, here, postmarketos says "however big retail's brands if your device is, we can support it" ; where for long time sailfish/UB was "samung? just no.."

i think freebsd could have a very good project allowing a new alternative, especially for an already *bsd market, to get a new proposal on hardware.

kpedersen said:
For standard hardware, absolutely but as an example; how old is your oldest phone that you still get use from personally?
Click to expand...

i still use daily samsung-a3 (2016), samsung g530fz (2014), and galaxytab2 (espressowifi) with postmarketos. This last one without 3D acc but i just use it to read pdf, but at least : it doesnt runs android.

with the two firsts devices, i can run postmarket/phosh, but i admit as a free/*bsd user beginner, i would be more than happy to have phosh running on a postmarket device + on a freebsd device. Just as you can run kde, gnome, cinnamon on various systems, not only linux, but *bsd too, why not getting it on a mobile?
as even today several big linux distros aims to run it on mobile : fedora, etc...

dostoievsky said:
Yeah, alot of things can happen like telecom companies just dropping support of a carrier kind of connection, and so on. But seeing the pinephone case, it then, would just be needed to change the modem, not the entire phone. A part of the hardware dosent work anymore, but the rest is still plenty.

I that case, yeah, we would still also depending that the manofacturer sees advantage and $$$ on it. But well, I believe that is possible. In the worst case, I will get a mobile computer, but it will not be discarted, because a lot of things will keep possible.
Click to expand...

the thing would be to do not stay in the trap of manjaro, whom benefits a bit too much of kind of contract with the PP. Sailfish on the same : jolla+xperia, or community ports..
but adapt it to various brands, etc.. for me it's the key of adaptation : being available on big brands, samsung, huawei, xiaomo, htc.. i dont think if postmarket did it, that it would be impossible for a bsd one.
 
This is completely OT but one of the first M$ (semi) Smartphone was based on NetBSD, it is a shame that I don't find that article anywhere...
 
lm2lm2 said:
i think few hundreds of device is kind of "a bit more" than fraction of few devices
Click to expand...
I think you potentially(?) misunderstood. PostmarketOS only supports a fraction of device models.

lm2lm2 said:
but at least : it doesnt runs android.
Click to expand...
Are you sure? PostmarketOS traditionally just used the Android kernel and created a semi-general purpose Linux environment in a chroot. What does your uname -a say?
 
Hello everyone. Linux enthiusist here :)

I was searching for "FreeBSD mobile" and this page was one of the top hits. I have a Nokia 800 Tough which runs KaiOS,a BOOX eink tablet which runs Android. I also have got a Nokia 2780 Flip and a Sony ericsson xperia mini as development devices. The stock OS of the former is KaiOS and the latter a very old version of Android.

As you can see, since like 2018, there is a third kinda major player in the market: KaiOS. I develop many apps for KaiOS, including a Matrix client.

The sole purpose of my development devices are tinkering with Linux mobile and pmOS on them. As a characteristic of many KaiOS devices, is that they haven't got many hardware features and therefore implementing full support of these phones by pmOS is far easier.

On all my computers, I run Linux(Debian). However there are disadvantages Linux might have like the entire management is done by a single mortal person.
 
kpedersen said:
Are you sure? PostmarketOS traditionally just used the Android kernel and created a semi-general purpose Linux environment in a chroot. What does your uname -a say?
Click to expand...
PostmarketOS uses Alpine Linux, it needs specific devices exactly because of that: needs to support a mainline kernel to work properly.
 
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